True Healing Discussion (Live 6/25)

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True Healing Discussion (Live 6/25)

Postby IceIX » Mon Jun 23, 2014 2:59 pm

New feature: True Healing
    Characters receive true healing if their powers heal their wounds. Character powers that ease combat but don't heal wounds provide temporary health.
    - The following abilities are considered true healing:
      - Ares (Dark Avengers): Sunder - This ability is more a moment of weakness than actual damage, so Ares gains health back when the weakness passes.
      - Daken (Classic) and (Dark Avengers Wolverine): Healing & Heat
      - Wolverine (Patch) and (Astonishing X-Men): Healing Factor
      - Wolverine (X-Force): Recovery
    - The following abilities are considered temporary healing:
      - Black Widow (Original): Anti-Gravity Device - This ability uses gravitic fields that lets heroes fight more easily despite injuries. It doesn't heal them of these injuries however.
      - Spider-Man (Classic): Web Bandages - These bandages help heroes fight through pain but do not provide actual healing.
      - She-Hulk (Modern): Reprieve – She-Hulk allows for the team to take a rest from combat for a moment and gather their strength but does not heal any wounds.

Edit 2: We've also finished up planning on a companion to this new change. This additional change will result in a reduction in time needed to naturally regen characters for most characters in the game.

Old Healing Rates
    - All characters regain 12 health/minute
    - Wolverine and Daken regain 24 health per minute

New Healing Rates
    - 2* characters regain 18 health/minute (1.5x faster)
    - 3* characters regain 24 health/minute (2x faster)
    - 4* characters regain 30 health/minute (2.5x faster)
    - Characters with significant regenerative powers: Wolverine, Daken, Spider-Man, Hulk, and She-Hulk regain health at double the rate.

Edit: Added some reasoning from further in the thread
One of the intentions with this change is to cut down on things like Prologue Healing, which prolongs play time through something that is pretty obviously just a time intensive process that doesn't involve actual strong gameplay. It's something people do because it's there, much like tanking. It's not something that's fun. It's not something that's enjoyable. It's something that exists and is taken advantage of because of pure efficiency.

What we intend, and continue to drill in on is that we want players to have a broad mix of characters instead of a Top 3 that is their sole team to play with. In Versus this is a bit rougher of a prospect as players that battle have their last winning team placed on defense. So it's not always the best idea to fight with a less powerful defensive team in order to make up more points. That's something that we're always thinking about. We've discussed allowing players to set a defensive team, but with many other games out with similar versus situations this results in a very precise meta-game where an extremely large percentage of the user base chooses the same defenders. That's not a very fun time for most players.

However, in Events, we continually buff different characters, and outside of Heroics, still allow for characters to be used that aren't buffed. What we want players to do is to play with the breadth of their roster instead of using Spider-Man or Black Widow as necessary crutches and only building 3 other characters. This change is intended to result in exactly this as players see that they can't just rely on in-battle healing and look for other ways besides spending Health Packs to continue playing. We want you to keep playing on your own schedule. We want you to play with multiple characters. Doing so keeps players on their toes and making them think of character combinations that they wouldn't otherwise go with if they weren't forced out of their single set of heroes.
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby AkaTobi_85 » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:00 pm

So does this mean that once the match is over, any damage that they've sustained comes back? Would that also potentially knock out a character if they're under 0 HP after this false healing goes away?
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby pallmall » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:06 pm

wow, this really takes a chunk out of Oh Bee Dub's usefulness. Pre release nerf of Shulkie, and second round nerf bat for Spidey. :roll:
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby Phantron » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:06 pm

It's hard for me to tell what mechanism is intended but I'd think OBW can actually heal a bit more if her heal is temporary, same with Spiderman.

I think Patch and Daken should have their abilities changed so that true healing is only provided at the highest levels, and it probably shouldn't be 100% true healing.
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby SteveS » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:09 pm

Way to omit just enough detail to prevent meaningful discussion.
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby gamar » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:09 pm

AkaTobi_85 wrote:So does this mean that once the match is over, any damage that they've sustained comes back? Would that also potentially knock out a character if they're under 0 HP after this false healing goes away?


Hopefully once a character gets temp HP all damage is applied to the temp HP until it runs out, so damage wouldn't "come back"
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby DayvBang » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:09 pm

So this is how prologue healing gets removed.

Healers are just as good on defense, but lose their awesomeness on offense. Overall I don't mind the change, but I've stopped using team healing regularly since the Spidey nerf.

This will change meta a lot, and might require rebalancing of some of the healing abilities in the long run, most particularly Spidey's where the only secondary effect is the possible removal of webs.
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby Chimaera » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:11 pm

Ya I don't get it.

Does temporary healing only permanently heal damage done in that match?

If you take any damage and heal that damage are you fully healed at the end of the match or not?

If you take damage then try and heal it in a different game, does your health return to the previous value once the match is done?

Are you adjusting the health regeneration factor so covers don't take 11 hours to regenerate?
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Last edited by Chimaera on Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby pasa_ » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:12 pm

Discussion? Guess we are supposed to GUESS that the heck the terms temporary and other words mean?

How about writing down in plain English up front and/or provide some example of what happens in-game and after the game.
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby Ghast » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:13 pm

I think he forgot to cut and paste a paragraph in his haste to get in and out of here without actually communicating with anyone.
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby gamar » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:15 pm

pasa_ wrote:Discussion? Guess we are supposed to GUESS that the heck the terms temporary and other words mean?

How about writing down in plain English up front and/or provide some example of what happens in-game and after the game.

I assume it works like D&D's temporary hit points:

Certain effects give a character temporary hit points. When a character gains temporary hit points, note his current hit point total. When the temporary hit points go away [in MPQ I assume this is when the battle ends] the character’s hit points drop to the noted hit point total. If the character’s hit points are below his noted hit point total at that time, all the temporary hit points have already been lost and the character’s hit point total does not drop further.
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby mohio » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:15 pm

Time to grab some popcorn ;) Thread's about to blow up.

edit: Also, I'm just as confused as everyone else. It *seems* like once you take damage that damage is forever on that character, and even healing with OBW/Spidey/She-Hulk in the same battle will only be temporary. However it's so vague, it might only be that all damage sustained at the end of a match cannot be healed back to full health in subsequent matches outside of "true" healing, which is effectively only nerfing prologue-style healing (although I will often heal my Thor/Pun an extra 1-2k in some matches and bring them back to max over the course of a couple matches, so it's not strictly prologue healing). If it's the former, it's a big change and I'm not a fan, but I will adjust. If it's the latter, I'm not sure I really care all that much and am completely fine with it.
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Last edited by mohio on Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby Spoit » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:18 pm

So, it marks the health at the time of the cast, and then anything above that is lost after the battle? I guess it would be too much to hope for for the temporary health to actually be able to exceed the maximum, without wasting it in that case.

Any estimate of the time frame IceIX?
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby gamar » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:18 pm

mohio wrote:Time to grab some popcorn ;) Thread's about to blow up.


OBW still OP
Spidey still crappy
Sentry hugely nerfed

;)
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby Ghast » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:19 pm

The fireworks start flying when they gently nudge the price of health packs to 500 HP for 4 a week after this change takes place.

gamar wrote:Sentry hugely nerfed


Only for f2p and whales. The cheaters get free healing anyway and the Krakens can afford to pay $100 a week on the game.
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby Spoit » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:21 pm

Talking about spidey, does this swing the preferred build back to 3/5/5?
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby OSU Buckeyes » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:22 pm

I would guess any health gained from the temporary characters only last during that match and the character goes to their previous health post match where Patch, Daken, etc. are able to truly heal.

This makes sense and as someone who has never used a healing character to heal myself I am ok with this change but I know a lot of people won't be happy. Hopefully this leads to less OBW being used, getting tired of her.
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby Incredible_Bulk » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:23 pm

So the terrible healing mechanics just got worse?!
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby eidehua » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:24 pm

I am thinking the temporary health is basically just a shield that lasts the duration of a match. Damage will go through that shield first. However, unlike a real shield it won't go over the characters max health the way it's worded.
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Re: Upcoming Feature: True Healing Discussion

Postby jozier » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:25 pm

Spidey is now legitimately the worst character in the game.

His only feature is to temporarily heal someone in battle? At the cost of 12 yellow AP? Or for an extra bonus of 15!! blue AP he can heal for another 700?

Why would anyone voluntarily use him?
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Last edited by jozier on Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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